2025-06-26

Having got warmed up, does Deputy Doherty want to contribute under Standing Order 38?

Tá brú ollmhór ar theaghlaigh de bharr praghsanna atá ag ardú. Ní chreideann daoine a gcluasa nuair a deir an Rialtas nach ndéanfaidh sé a dhath le tacú leo. Ní féidir leo a thuilleadh de na praghsanna seo a fhulaingt. Caithfidh an Rialtas pacáiste tacaíochta a thabhairt chun cinn láithreach a thabharfaidh faoiseamh d'oibrithe agus do theaghlaigh. Soaring prices - that is what everybody is talking about out there. In the last couple of weeks, we put out a cost-of-living survey online. Thousands of people replied to that survey and the results mirrored what we hear every day. The price of everything is going through the roof and people are finding it harder and harder to keep their heads above water. Almost 70% of respondents to our survey say they were just managing to get by. People are sick of seeing their hard-earned money swallowed up by out-of-control prices and are fed up with barely keeping up. They are hit from all angles, whether extortionate rents, massive energy bills, the high cost of petrol and diesel or unaffordable childcare. The one thing that is putting households under most pressure at this time is the cost of food. Some 91% of respondents told us they were struggling with runaway grocery prices. As part of the survey, we asked them to tell us their stories. I want to share a few of them today. Jackie wrote: My weekly food shop bill has doubled. 4 years ago I wasn’t worried about the summer holidays. But kids will want days out and treats. Just like ice cream. I can’t afford that. I haven't brought myself new clothes in 3 years. I don[']t sleep well with worry. Paul says: When we go grocery shopping we tend to buy the cheapest brands and try to get our meat and poultry at a discounted price in the sell by date fridge. We worry that we’re not eating properly. We're afraid to turn on the heating when it’s needed [because] our bill goes through the roof. We’ve a 7 year old son. It hurts telling him that we can’t afford to buy him nice things. Lorraine told us: As two university graduates with 4 children, we struggle every week. Only one parent can work full time as childcare is too expensive. We are trying to manage 6 people on 1 salary. Our grocery bill has skyrocketed. We try to save on our electricity bill but this is also way higher than it was 4 years ago. Our health insurance puts us into debt but we have to pay it because one of us has a life threatening medical condition. It’s infuriating. My teenagers are going to college soon. I have no idea how we will pay for that. Thousands of people filled in this online survey. That is a snapshot of what they are feeling about out-of-control prices and what they are doing to people. It is a nightmare for folks out there and they cannot believe their ears when they hear the Tánaiste or Taoiseach, or their partners in government, stand up and say they will not do anything for them and will not bring forward a cost-of-living package in this year's budget. The State has never been better off but the hard-working people who made that happen have been left high and dry. How is that fair? The Tánaiste says - and I am sure he will say it again - that the Government is aware of what people are going through, but then he does nothing. He rules out a cost-of-living package. He cannot keep patting himself on the back for the things the Government did last year or the year before. People are under pressure right here, right now. That is Paul's experience, Jackie's experience and countless experiences across this State. They need help now. I am pleading with the Tánaiste to change his mind. I ask the Government to do its job and bring forward a package of supports that will provide relief for these households. It needs to bring a cost-of-living package forward without delay.

I thank the Deputy for raising this issue. I want to acknowledge at the outset, because it is true, that people in this country are still finding the cost of living a very significant issue. I know that, the Deputy knows that and there is not a TD in Dáil Éireann who is not aware of that in their own community and from their own constituency work. I want to be clear the Government is taking action in the here and now in a variety of areas. It is not a question of the Government saying people have to wait until the budget for supports. The Government is taking action this month that will have an effect on people in a range of areas. I will give a few examples. This month 114,000 carers will receive the highest carer's support grant ever, and rightly so. Next month, we will see income levels for the carer's allowance increase so many more people will qualify for financial support. Over the summer months, the back-to-school clothing and footwear allowance will be paid out. In September, there will be a significant increase in the number of people who qualify for the fuel allowance, allowing more people who are worried about heating bills, particularly in the run-up to winter, to qualify for that allowance for the first time ever. This month and again later this year, public sector pay will increase, including for the lowest paid workers in the public service, benefitting around 300,000 people. Anybody with a child starting secondary school in September will see the free schoolbooks scheme that has been a real success at primary school extend to secondary school. The Deputy talked about the cost of food. He will see for the first time the roll-out of the summer version of the hot school meals, what we are calling a summer meals programme. Women going into the pharmacy to access HRT see that it has been made free in the last number of weeks. Student grant payments will increase from September and childcare costs have fallen this year. When the Government came into office, we decided to extend the reduced VAT rate on gas electricity for exactly the reasons the Deputy mentioned, which is that if we had not done so, we would have had the VAT rate at 13.5%. We thought that was wrong so we took the decision to make that 9%. In recent weeks, we brought about a reduction in levy, which is called the renewable electricity public service obligation. That will give people an approximately 40% reduction in the levy and save them a few bob on their electricity bills. The Government is taking action on the cost of living and I do not think it is right or proper to get into a branding exercise about whether there will be a cost-of-living "package". There will be measures to help people in the budget with the cost of living, absolutely. Read our programme for Government and read what we want to do on childcare and for small businesses. Read what we intend to do for carers and how we intend to support farmers. Expect to see progress in this budget and the next number of budgets as we seek to fulfil that. I push back very strongly against the narrative that anyone in government is saying we should sit back and wait many months. I have given more than ten examples of where we are already helping people with the cost of living. We want to build on that. We can all say inflation is falling and that is true. We have been through a big inflationary crisis, probably the biggest since the 1970s, but I accept there is a significant time lag in many areas between inflation falling and citizens seeing any benefit in their bills. The Deputy referenced groceries. There is a commitment in the programme for Government to expand the powers of the CCPC. That should happen. We have seen recent examples of it taking action to protect consumers. We need to see how we can strengthen its powers further.

The Tánaiste says inflation is falling and it will take a while for people to feel the effects, but he knows the phrase "inflation is falling" means pricing are still going up. It just means they are not going up as fast as they were in the past. It means the prices people have seen go up in recent years are higher today. That is the real lived experience of Jackie, Paul, Lorraine and thousands of people across the State. The Tánaiste can pat himself on the back as much as he wants for what he has done but people's lived experience is that not enough is being done. The Government has ruled out a cost-of-living package in this year's budget. It is the wrong approach. The Government has done other things the Tánaiste did not mention. For example, it passed legislation last night meaning every person in this State will pay more local property tax. Earlier this year, it put up the price of petrol and diesel. Also earlier this year, it put up the price of gas and heating oil to keep people's homes warm. Just in the last weeks, the Government has ensured that rents will go up for new renters right across the State, including students that the Government talked about in terms of student supports. That is also the lived experience of people. Let us get down to basics. Costs are going through the roof. People are struggling with their weekly shopping. A Minister of State said he was going to stop this. He was going to tackle this. He said he was going to call into the supermarket two years ago. He was going to lay down the law and everything was going to change within six weeks. Prices are through the roof. This Government is impotent in the face of that. People are struggling. I am asking the Government again for a cost-of-living package that will support families and workers right throughout this State in the middle of this cost-of-living crisis. It is what is needed. It needs to be brought forward without delay.

Hear, hear.

The Deputy is accusing me of saying things that I never said. Nobody suggested here that anyone is patting themselves on the back. What I did for the people watching at home was push back against the Deputy's misinformation and disinformation that the Government is not taking action on the cost of living. People know the record of this Government in helping them through the past number of years. They know how many measures we took. However, I am also making the point because I do not want fear and anxiety to be sewed in people that this Government is taking help today. We are putting measures in place to help today. Look at what we are doing relating to the carer's support grant. Look at what we are doing to make sure more people can qualify next month for the carer's allowance. Look at what we are doing to make sure more people qualify for the fuel allowance in September. Look at what we are doing to increase student grants from September. Look at what we are doing in terms of increasing public sector pay. Look at what we are doing in relation to free secondary school books. Look at what we are doing relating to free hormone replacement therapy, HRT. We will continue to do this. Does the Deputy know what else we will do? We will keep the economy safe because we are in a turbulent time as well. The Deputy comes in here and says to abolish the carbon levy, get rid of the property tax, get rid of this and then spend a load more too. People saw through that in the election.

No more so than you.

That is why they voted to put a centrist Government back in office.

Hear, hear.

Tomorrow will mark another dark day when the latest homeless figures are published. The figure will be over 15,000. This is the population of a town the size of Tullamore. There were 4,775 children homeless in the most recent figures, each an individual tragedy. "The impact of homelessness and unstable living conditions on children is catastrophic" were the words of the Ombudsman for Children on Tuesday at the housing committee. Let us go back just five years to May 2020 and there were 2,787 children homeless. In five years, there has been a 60% increase in child homelessness. The long-lasting effects of such trauma and displacement put these children at increased risk of poverty, social exclusion and adult homelessness long after they have moved out of homeless services. If the Government wants confirmation of the total failure of its housing policies, that statistic sums it up. The Tánaiste admitted yesterday homelessness is too high in Ireland and we have to work every day to do better and more. The ombudsman called for bold brave measures to address the crisis. There is a need for a specific child and family homelessness strategy built on three pillars: prevention; supports in homelessness, and delivery of social and affordable housing. On all measures, the Government is failing. There is no point telling a homeless child we are building more social homes than at any point since the 1970s. This Government and the previous one had “one of the highest levels of public expenditure for housing, yet one of the poorest outcomes”. These are the words of the Housing Commission and not mine. There is a level of inertia in the delivery of public housing that is impossible to understand. Councillors and local authorities across the country will tell us of the dead hand of the Custom House restricting their ability to get on with it. The private sector will not solve this crisis; only the State can. We know that the tenant in situ scheme has been gutted. We know the Minister has stalled 500 homes by pausing public-private partnerships, PPPs. We know that the Government has hiked rents in the private rental sector. There is an €8 billion surplus, but we cannot keep families in their homes. These are things within the Government's control. I wrote to the Minister for housing with policy measures to address homelessness in March, but I still have not received a response. The programme for Government has no mention of homelessness prevention. There are huge variations in how individual councils treat homeless children. Labour proposed the Housing (Homeless Families) Bill eight years ago. This was supported by Focus Ireland and has passed pre-legislative scrutiny. The previous Minister considered including it in the Housing (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2024 last year, but failed to act. The Ombudsman for Children called for the same measure in its 2019 report No Place Like Home. Will the Government now act? How many children must suffer the trauma of homelessness before we see real emergency measures? Will the Government heed the words of the Ombudsman for Children with bold and brave action and a dedicated strategy? For nearly 5,000 children, it is already too late. The Tánaiste wants to do better and more. Will he at least put a plan in place?

I thank the Deputy for highlighting what is the biggest domestic emergency we face in this country - the issue of housing. It is nowhere more acute than when it comes to children. We are united on that. I have huge respect for the Ombudsman of Children, Dr. Niall Muldoon, for the work of his office and his independence. Both of the parties in government established this structure because it is good to have somebody to hold the feet of Government to the coals and keep us under pressure. The points he made this week remind us of the real acuity of this situation. He made a number of constructive suggestions, including asking the Oireachtas joint committee on housing to play a role in this. I am quite sure that across parties, Members will want to see happen. I say respectfully to the ombudsman and to the Deputy that it is actually because we are so aware of the issues relating to children that we are taking some of the measures that we have taken. I said this yesterday. The no-fault eviction ban that we are legislating for will help keep children in their homes. I think the Deputy will agree with that. On cost rental, I was out in Tallaght yesterday where we have the first cost-rental scheme by a council, opposed to the Land Development Agency, LDA. It is a good development in Tallaght. There are 133 homes, playgrounds and a school to go in. This will help children in knowing where they are going to be living for their childhood. That is good. That needs to become a template for the rest of the country. I take the Deputy's point, though I disagree with it, but I understand why he said there is no point telling a child that this is the greatest number of social homes being allocated since the 1970s. I will gently push back because these homes are being allocated to families with children. These are real people moving into these homes. We have a social house building programme back up and running. I agree with the Deputy on one point, although I will not share the language of the "dead hand". I take the point he made in relation to too many gates and barriers in the context of local authorities getting on with social housing. As recently as this week, we discussed this with the housing Minister. The Minister, Deputy Browne, intends to bring forward proposals to rectify that and to empower councils to move much more quickly on this. That cannot come soon enough. We have tried to take a number of big and bold decisions since this Government came into office, including providing clarity relating to rent pressure zones, RPZ; plans relating to the no-fault evictions; reforming our planning laws; and providing more money for the delivery of social and affordable homes. The Deputy will see us take more actions in the national development plan next month to help house building, including the infrastructure that is necessary around water, wastewater and energy. During the election, the Labour Party made a constructive suggestion on the role of the LDA. The party wishes to reform it. We have different views on it, but we have agreed with this much, which is that certainly the mandate of the LDA needs to be expanded. We have taken decisions in recent weeks to give the LDA more power to do more and to deliver more homes. I do not want to misquote the Deputy but he said something about private investment and public investment. There is a need for both. When I read the Housing Commission report, it is very clear. We need to invest more publicly but we cannot just do it with public money. We also need to get private investment to get a functioning housing market in place too.

While the measures that the Government announced last week relating to security of tenure are welcome, they were undermined completely by allowing landlords to reset rents to market rate. The Housing Commission was clear that social and affordable housing should form 20% of our housing stock. It currently forms less than 10% of all housing stock. If the Tánaiste has huge respect for the Ombudsman for Children, as he said he has, I hope he will heed what he said and come forward with a bespoke plan to deal with child homelessness, but also include our homeless families Bill that is sitting in the ether for eight years in the housing (miscellaneous provisions) Bill 2025. Words are not enough. The Government has the authority to act, pass legislation and as the Tánaiste said last year when he became Taoiseach to "move mountains". This is the biggest crisis that we face and it is not being treated with the appropriate level of seriousness by this Government.

I wish the assure the Deputy that it is. I also assure him that I am aware of the mountain that needs to be climbed to where we need to get to. We will give consideration very much to how we take forward the views of the Ombudsman for Children, whether that is through bespoke strategies or reflected in specific actions in the new housing plan. He is not wrong regarding the need for a renewed focus for children and family homelessness. I will ask the Minister to revert to the Deputy on the Labour Party Bill. It not just about words from the Government. We have taken approximately nine actions since this Government came into office. We have reformed the planning laws relating in relation to permissions. We are increasing the amount of land available for housing by directing local authorities to revisit their development plans to zone more land for homes. We have provided more money already for the delivery of social and affordable homes. We are providing more housing options for younger and older people by exempting developments in people's gardens and on their own land. We are expanding the role of the Land Development Agency, meaning the State developer will be active in many more parts of the country, which is important. We are trying to stimulate the construction of new apartments. We have provided clarity and certainty on rent pressure zones. We are regulating short-term lets and in the coming weeks we will provide more funding for housing directly and for enabling infrastructure, such as water and wastewater.

Every day people in Gaza play what is called "the hunger games". After two months without a shred of food, milk, medicine or flour coming into the territory, they brave Israeli army bullets at feeding stations that have been set up, for the chance of a bag of flour, a tin of food or whatever for their starving families. We had indelible images from the Holocaust. These will be the indelible images from this holocaust against the Palestinians and history will record that this has been sanctioned and facilitated by the EU and US. Today, we saw the Taoiseach is at the EU summit. He will be blocked in any move to take action against Israel under the trade agreement. It is backed by bigger countries. The Tánaiste has repeatedly said we must use all levers at our disposal to end this genocide. Why does he not use all the levers he has at his disposal? We cannot wait for the EU to act in concert. The Government is introducing an occupied territories Bill, six years after it was introduced to the Dáil, just before the recess and 20 months into a genocide, but it is denuding the Bill because it does not include services. It does not have even half the power of the original Bill. Why are services not included in this Bill? The International Court of Justice, ICJ, makes no distinction between goods and services. The settlements are illegal and all trade with them should be ended. Some 75% of people in Ireland want the full occupied territories Bill to be passed. The Palestinian people need sanctions and there has been no legal advice to the contrary. Is this due to lobbying from companies like Airbnb that might be affected by this? The occupied territories Bill only covers a fraction of our trade with Israel. According to the United Nations Comtrade, our trade with Israel is worth €3.3 billion, the second highest after the US and above China. While the genocide was in full swing last year, for example, Ireland was the largest buyer of Israeli integrated circuits, while the Tánaiste was Taoiseach, €3 billion worth of integrated circuits that are used ironically in our health system while the people of Gaza were having their health system destroyed. I will not even go into the companies that are here and benefitting and part of the genocide, but I will ask the Tánaiste to use the lever of Shannon Airport and our airspace. Shannon Airport has become in effect a logistical military hub for the US.

What a statement.

What a statement.

It has become a significant transit point for the US military since 9/11. The RTÉ news data, for example, reported 2,000 applications for exemptions, of which only 0.1% were refused. Literally millions of US troops have passed through Shannon Airport in the past 20 years.

They are not going to Gaza.

Please conclude, Deputy.

Shannon Airport is a de facto military base and the US is financing the genocide on Gaza. Will the Tánaiste pull that lever and stop the US army from using Shannon Airport?

That was quite an extraordinary attempt to suggest that the country in the European Union, which has done more for and in standing by the people of Palestine is somehow or other complicit in an illegal, despicable genocide that is taking place.

I did not say that.

You effectively did.

You are, but I did not say it.

There you go.

There you go. You said it now. The mask slips very quickly with you, Deputy.

Stick to the question on the occupied territories Bill.

The way this place works is that the Deputy asks a question and then I have the right to answer. It is a democracy, so I ask that my mandate be respected too because I would like to answer the question. Surely to God, it does not need to be the case in everything that the Deputy is morally superior than everyone over here. Surely to God, sometimes we can actually recognise that it does not matter what our politics are or where we are on the political spectrum. We are all sickened by the genocide and we are not divided on that. Perhaps every now and then we could pull together and be clear about that. The Deputy is again using language that the sponsor of the Bill, Senator Black, the woman who actually did all the work on the legislation, does not use. I have met Senator Black. She did a great job by the way. She is a good person who is trying to do the right thing. I said clearly to her that we would get that Bill to pre-legislative scrutiny, that we would not dilly-dally and wait for clarity on whether it was possible to include services. We will get the Bill in on goods and do the pre-legislative scrutiny. I have made it clear that, from a policy perspective, we have no issue with adding services. I want to do everything possible to make it clear we stand with the ICJ. We are the only Government in the entire European Union that has published any legislation - ever - to ban trade with the occupied Palestinian territories. We are the only one. I had a good conversation with Deputy Bacik on this and I thank her, but I have not had anyone else in the Opposition ring me about this. I would be very grateful if every member of the Opposition in a leadership position would do one thing today and that is to pick up the telephone and contact their political counterparts in the European Union and ask them where is their occupied Palestinian territories Bill and when will it be published.

Hear, hear.

Hear, hear.

Hear, hear.

I would like to know because it is by all of us coming together that we will create the momentum that Netanyahu's genocide cannot be tolerated. What the Deputy said about Shannon Airport is an attempt to conflate a number of issues. It is an attempt to suggest somehow or other that Shannon Airport is being used to assist with the horrific activity in Gaza. There is no evidence of that at all. I ask the Deputy to clarify that is not what she is saying. She is right about, and my Department publishes every month on our website, exactly what happens in terms of flights that land. It is quite transparent. I want to make it quite clear that there is no evidence of any flight stopping at Shannon Airport to transport any weapons or any military personnel participating in any genocidal activity in Gaza or the Middle East. I would appreciate if the Deputy would agree with me on that. She certainly has no evidence of that either. We will pass a Bill that shows solidarity with the people of Palestine and the ICJ. What we are also going to do is what the Taoiseach is trying to do today, that is build an alliance to try to get other countries involved. The Deputy is right on this point, that we cannot wait for EU unanimity. We waited far too long and we have to move on. I am asking like-minded countries today to move with us and I would appreciate the Deputy's support on that.

The point of my contribution was that we are the second biggest trader with Israel. It is worth €3.3 billion. The occupied territories Bill is a fraction of that. It is a welcome step. The question is why the Government is not moving forward the whole occupied territories Bill that was originally proposed in the Dáil six years ago. It was unanimously or certainly overwhelmingly supported. Fianna Fáil brought it in and was cheering and whooping about it. The Government has the chance to bring in the whole Bill. There is no legal impediment to doing so that the Government has identified. Why not introduce Frances Black's full Bill? It would have been much quicker. The word "complicity" means that you are involved in something or you know something is wrong and do not do anything about it.

Thank you for explaining it.

For 20 months, we have all known that what has been going on is wrong and very little has been done by Ireland-----

Not True.

-----to use the levers. The levers are there, but is the Government willing to pull them?

That is not true

The first lever is the occupied territories Bill. The Government needs to move it and make sure the Bill gets in before the recess. However, there are other issues such as Shannon Airport and the Bill on the Israeli war bonds, which the Tánaiste and members of Government voted down. The bar is low in the EU. There is no point in comparing yourself to them.

Thank you, Deputy Coppinger.

This is about a neutral country standing up for the people of Palestine.

The people of Palestine know we are standing up for them. Deputy Coppinger might not want to acknowledge or appreciate that. The Palestinian ambassador wrote to Sligo County Council in the past week and said Ireland's commitment to international law and human rights will always be seen and commended by the Palestinian people. Every effort by the Government of Ireland to stop Israel's genocide and war crimes on the Palestinian people is highly valued. The person who is in our country representing the people of Palestine wrote to Sligo County-----

You are collaborators with the Israeli regime.

What?

Withdraw that.

Hang on a second. It is hard to keep up with the Deputy.

You are seen as that by Palestinians.

I would like to use the 32 seconds available to me. It is hard to keep up with the Deputy's logic. The Palestinian ambassador has written-----

Talk to Palestinians.

-----to thank the people and Government of Ireland. Funnily enough, I attach a greater value to her view, as the representative of the people of Palestine, than I do to the Deputy's view on behalf of the people of Palestine.

Sound bites.

She represents them. That is how it works. She is their representative in this country. We made her an ambassador by recognising the State of Palestine. On the occupied territories Bill, let me be clear. There are legal issues about services. We will tease through them and, if we can make progress on them that is what we intend to do, but we need other countries to move. If this is not about performative politics and actually about helping to save lives in Gaza, today we need to call on other EU member states to join us and bring forward their own legislation and stop waiting for EU unanimity. Let us get on with the job. I must give her credit for that. Specifically in respect of early access schemes as a focus in the programme for Government, I need to emphasise how important it is that any early access scheme needs to be decoupled from the existing reimbursement process. If we are going to put drugs through a process that essentially has to run through the same hoops as the system that is currently in place, it will be doomed to failure. That is my concern. Typically you are looking at 600, 700 or 800 days for reimbursement for a rare drug. As I said, any system that provides for early access will have to radically overhaul that. The second point in the programme for Government is a commitment to a review of the reimbursement system as a whole. Again, that is something I have sought for a number of years. Any review we undertake cannot be a carbon copy of the Mazars report. The Mazars report, from inception to its actual publication, took the best part of four or five years. We have committed to this in the programme for Government as a provision. We need to actually start the process of reviewing the current reimbursement system now. If we wait a further two years, we are not going to see the full published review by the end of this Government's term. Today I ask for two things. Will the Tánaiste give me the direction of any thinking in respect of an early access scheme? How quickly can that come on stream? With regard to the overall review of the reimbursement system, will the Tánaiste give a commitment that it will start urgently so that we can at least have it published in the next couple of years?

When I heard the Deputy would be asking a question today I did not have to ask what topic it was likely to be about. I want to acknowledge that, probably more than any other Member, he raises this issue on a very consistent basis. I acknowledge he is a passionate advocate for those with rare diseases. I thank him for the focus he is keeping on that. I know he has had good engagement with the Minister for Health on this matter and I am very pleased with the work she is doing and her determination to make more progress on the issue of rare diseases and early access to medication for people with rare diseases. I will say that, at a high level, we have over the past four years delivered access to 194 new medicines, 74 of which were for cancer, but 49 of which were for rare diseases. While accepting we have a lot more to do, we are beginning to make progress in relation to access for rare diseases. The last budget allocation was €30 million for new medicines, to come from within the HSE. We have doubled the capacity of the HSE pricing and reimbursement system. Some of this is about the quantum of funding but, in terms of speeding up the process, it is also about making sure there are enough people working in the system. I am very pleased that we have almost doubled the capacity of those now working on the reimbursement system for new medication. We now have a medicines application tracker to try to increase the transparency because we want this country to do even better in these matters. The programme for Government commits to an early access scheme. It will be for the Minister to outline how she intends to take that forward, with Government colleagues, in the time ahead, but the points the Deputy made here today are very fair. If it is to be an early access scheme that is to make a difference, that is to be somewhat of a disruptor in terms of making sure people can get access to those medicines much more quickly, it will have to be not just a carbon copy of the existing structures or a parallel process with the same likely outcome. Let us take that away and make sure that is a factor. Another commitment in the programme for Government that is worth commenting on is the commitment around the heel prick test. We have two population-based newborn screening programmes now and the programme for Government is committing to continually reviewing the number of conditions babies are screened for. Of course, that will help in terms of the early detection of rare diseases as well. Since May 2022, babies have been screened for nine conditions. The previous Minister for Health endorsed the recommendations from the screening advisory committee to add two new conditions. Once implemented, this will bring the number of conditions screened for as part of what is commonly known as the heel prick test in Ireland to 11. Last year, work also began on a complex and detailed process of introducing screening for spinal muscular atrophy, SMA, and for SCID to the national newborn heel prick test. In terms of the rare disease action plan we have made a number of commitments in the programme for Government and the Minister for Health will bring the new rare diseases strategy to Government for endorsement in the coming weeks. I expect it will be published shortly thereafter. We will look at how we can advance some of the points made through that structure. In terms of a timeline for the talks on the reimbursement framework beginning, we are eager for that to happen as quickly as possible. We are currently working to identify how quickly that can happen.

The Tánaiste referenced the number of staff that the State has put in, as one example. Despite the number of staff increasing from four to 30-odd at this stage, the length of time it takes to assess a drug is actually lengthening, not shortening, despite the additional staff. That is one point of clarity. The Tánaiste also referenced the heel prick test. The decision to add those two extra conditions was made in 2022, as he said. That was largely down to Les Martin in Wicklow, a constituent of the Tánaiste's, who was right behind that campaign. That decision was made in 2022. Fast forward to 2025 and the two conditions referenced are still not being tested for despite them being recommended in 2022. It has not been implemented. Within the health Act there are specific deadlines for the National Centre for Pharmacoeconomics, NCPE, to make decisions. It is supposed to make a decision within 180 days. A recent report by the Irish Pharmaceutical Healthcare Association, IPHA, stated that 86% of all applications are not being dealt with within the legislative times provided for in the health Act 2013. Some 86% of all applications are going overdue. The NCPE administers all this. The NCPE makes the decisions. I am not casting aspersions on anybody in that organisation. It has handled hundreds of millions of euro in taxpayers' money over the past decade but there is no oversight, no governance, no independent chair, no SLA, nothing. That was a recommendation in the Mazars report a number of years ago. That needs to be done. As I said, I am not casting aspersions on anybody, but a lot of taxpayers' money has been handed over.

I thank the Deputy for referencing Les Martin, a person I know well from County Wicklow and somebody who has done incredible advocacy work in relation to this based on the lived experience of his two sons. I thank Les for that work too. The points Deputy O'Sullivan makes are fair. The Minister has rightly reminded me that she is committed to a root-and-branch reform and examination of all the various processes in place in relation to rare diseases. The opportunity to bring forward the new rare diseases plan will be a chance to turbocharge our focus on some of these issues. However, we are already beginning to look at how we can do this in new ways. For example, the Minister, Deputy Carroll MacNeill, had engagement with her Italian counterpart in recent days on how we can co-operate and collaborate more across the European Union. Deputy O'Sullivan raised the issue of DMD in the House last week and we went to the North-South Ministerial Council. In fairness, it was also raised by Deputy Crowe. At the North-South Ministerial Council we immediately started a conversation about how our two departments of health can work together. On part of the island you might have the medication, while on another part of the island you might have the professionals. Particularly given that we live in a small country, collaboration at European level, across the island of Ireland and across Ireland and the UK are going to be important steps. The Minister is committed to continuing close engagement with the Deputy on it. On the reimbursement piece, we have significantly increased the staff to try to speed up the timelines. We will keep in close contact.