Jim O'Callaghan

I thank colleagues for their contributions. I recognise this is a very considerable piece of legislation. As some other colleague as indicated, it is the most important reform of Ireland's asylum laws in the State's history. The criticism is that it is being rushed. I will inform Members about the history of this legislation and how we have got to today and take on board some of the criticisms th…

I do not rule amendments out of order.

I am okay.

I frequently get invitations, which I welcome, from the Deputy's justice committee. I turn up and I answer a series of questions on international protection accommodation, international protection processing times or the International Protection Office. I have done it before and I have no difficulty doing it again. What we cannot do is turn the Committee Stage of this important legislation into a …

Once the legislation is enacted I will then identify when I am going to sign commencement orders under it. That always applies in respect of legislation. What needs to happen now is the Deputy needs to move amendments Nos. 2, 3 and 4 if we want to-----

Are the Deputy's amendments not in respect-----

Okay.

I move amendment No. 5: In page 16, between lines 34 and 35, to insert the following: " "absconding" means the action by which an applicant does not remain available to the competent administrative or judicial authorities of a Member State, such as by leaving the territory of the state without permission from the competent authorities, for reasons which are not beyond the applicant’s control;". …

Yes, that is correct.

It goes in there because it will be in this Act that we will have a definition.

Yes, it will be first definition of "absconding".

The purpose of it is to give an effect to a definition that is required under the reception conditions directive. There will be further amendments during the progress of the legislation through the Seanad in respect of the reception conditions but it is appropriate at this stage to have the definition of "absconding" within the legislation. Deputy Gannon asked whether it will apply if somebody tra…

Can the Deputy repeat that?

That is not an issue in terms of what is in the legislation. The number of deportation orders that were signed last year was in the region of over 4,000. Regarding people leaving the country who have deportation orders, I believe and the Department believes that if somebody is served with a deportation order in Ireland, it is very difficult to remain. They do not get any social protection payments…

I will briefly go back to the query raised by Deputy Gannon. I was probably too definitive in the response I gave to him in terms of the definition of "absconding". The definition states: "means the action by which an applicant does not remain available to the competent administrative or judicial authorities, such as by leaving the territory of the member state without permission from the competen…

There are difficulties in policing the travel of people from both sides of the Border. That is unquestionably the case. However, it is not correct to say there is no lawful way of policing that. The Border management unit does work there. An Garda Síochána is engaged and if people are not citizens of the UK or Ireland, they are not entitled to cross the Border. I have to keep emphasising that. Sim…

I will deal with Deputy Farrelly's point first. "Not beyond the applicant's control" may include circumstances where an applicant is outside of the jurisdiction out of their own control and taken outside the jurisdiction. The purpose there is to try absolve them in respect of that. In reply to Deputy Ó Súilleabháin, I can do many things in this Bill. I cannot get Irish unity in the legislation.

PNR is used for serious criminal activity. It is not used for international protection. Even if that was in place, we would still need to have a mechanism on the Border to check people. We must be honest and realistic about this. The Garda can do some stops in terms of stopping buses or checking individuals but in terms of using something like PNR, people would have to be checked as they go North …

I thank the Deputies for their contributions. I am aware that this is an issue of genuine concern to people in this House. The first thing I want to say is that I should and I will bring forward an amendment to define "legal counselling". I cannot, however, accept Deputy Carthy's amendment. The reason I cannot is because, under the Deputy's amendment, he goes further than what is envisaged by lega…

Article 16 states: For the purposes of the administrative procedure, free legal counselling shall include the provision of: (a) guidance on and an explanation of the administrative procedure including information on rights and obligations during that procedure; (b) assistance on the lodging of the application and guidance on: (i) the different procedures under which the application may be exam…

I thank colleagues for their contributions. I assure all of them that we will be debating the definition of "legal counselling" that I bring forward. I intend to bring it forward in the Seanad. I would have preferred to bring it here on Report Stage. As I stated at the outset, there were time pressures in respect of this. I am being honest about that. I am just reflecting on the matter. The defin…

I want to ensure that the legal counselling that is being provided will be very adequate. I believe it will be adequate. It will reflect the definitions that are contained within Deputy Kelly's amendment, as is set out in the administrative procedure regulation. That is the information I have for Deputy Kelly. On Deputy Carthy's amendment specifically, I cannot accept it. It places too great an o…

I will answer Deputy Ward while I have it in mind. That will be a matter for the Legal Aid Board. I will not specify in legislation that the board in providing legal counselling must do it individually. That would be an excessive reach in terms of a statute. It will be a matter for the Legal Aid Board to determine. Deputy Gannon referred to the hearings yesterday before the justice committee. I d…

It is very clear from that definition in Article 16 what legal counselling is. It is distinct from legal advice. We need to recognise that when people come in seeking international protection, they do not need the expertise of a very well-qualified senior solicitor. They need somebody who is expert in the area of applications for international protection. They need to be informed about the procedu…

No.