Micheál Martin

You said we were cutting back.

Obviously, any school where a need has been identified for additional SNAs will get that additionality.

In terms of the SNA-----

In terms of the SNA redeployment scheme, the Deputy must know that the Department has been working with the National Council for Special Education, NCSE, and education stakeholders, including Fórsa, to develop an SNA redeployment scheme to retain experienced SNAs in our schools. A circular on this new redeployment scheme is being finalised and will be issued in the coming weeks. There are no cuts…

I am glad, although I might have misinterpreted her, that the Deputy agrees with us on the macro picture. In other words, she agrees that there has been very significant expansion of SNAs.

That is something that needed to be said on her side. I appreciate that she has acknowledged the expansion that has occurred.

I fully accept that. We have paused it. I fully accept what has happened in that regard.

The next-----

There is a-----

With respect, I know the full needs of every child. They extend beyond the physical. It is a bit much of a question to ask but we will leave it at that. I am a parent as well. I was a teacher. My fundamental objective in politics is to realise the potential of every child in this country. In terms of SNAs, the 2014 circular is clear on the sensory needs and the role of SNAs in relation to that. A…

We have increased the number of SNAs.

You did not, actually.

Sorry. We have increased significantly the number of special needs assistants. I would welcome a proper engagement on this subject. The fallback position from Opposition all the time is "more, more, more, more". We should look at optimal deployment of all resources in our education system and at outcomes. There have to be reviews. Surely people are not suggesting we will never have reviews. There …

I am answering the question. The Deputy's attitude is that we can go to 26,000, 27,000 and 30,000 and it will be fine. That is not the full answer. In every area of policy, that is her answer - no analysis, no attempt at evaluation. Are we doing the right thing? Is this getting the optimal outcome for a given child? We need multidisciplinary approaches; that is my view. We need more SNAs. We are e…

Certainly, we can have an holistic, integrated approach to what is horrific criminal activity and behaviour in terms of presenting, enabling or facilitating access to hardcore pornographic material for children. That is illegal and against the law, and it will be prosecuted. If, by “integration”, the Deputy means integration with the Courts Service or decisions of judges, we cannot do that because…

It actually has worked. It is only one of many things we have to do, but maybe if people stopped the knee-jerk necessity of attacking Government for the sake of it because, from their perspective, they think it is the right thing to do, we could focus on the issue of the protection of children. In that instance, it was to give space to children to allow them to concentrate and socialise within the…

The Deputy spent the first three minutes attacking and condemning us and the last minute saying that if we are going to do something to protect children, we had better be careful not to do it. He has his reasons on civil-----

On civil liberty grounds, he is now saying not to do that. Perhaps we need proper engagement in the House. In first three minutes, the Deputy spoke about how terrible we are in not protecting children and so forth. We are coming up with an age verification tool to protect children and he is telling us not to do that if it has implications for civil liberties and so on. That is basically what he is…

On the alternative, I am not clear about the feasibility of banning mobile phones in their entirety. We did it in schools and the Deputy opposed it.

We did, and the Deputy opposed it.

The Deputy opposed the policy of enabling schools to ban mobile phones in schools and now he is telling me we should ban them all over the country, and for every child-----

Is the Deputy talking about children aged 12, 14, 15 or 16? Where is the cut-off?

Sixteen years of age. Okay.

That will be easy to implement, I would say.

Come on.