2025-12-11

89. Deputy Eoghan Kenny asked the Minister for Education and Youth the plans to deliver pension parity for school secretaries and caretakers as of December 2025; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [70181/25]

I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Michael Moynihan, for securing a school bus for Rahan National School. That is essential, and I thank him for his work. We have worked extremely closely on that school bus.

No doubt there will be a list of Members later on.

The bus has just come.

I wish to focus on secretaries and caretakers across the country and their pension parity and leave entitlements.

I thank the Deputy for his kind comments, although I noted a "but" towards the end of them. In recent months, while I have been in this role, I have seen right across the Chamber the commitment to education of all the spokespersons and Members of the House. The Deputy did a huge amount of work in relation to the Rahan school bus. That is what all of us should be doing because the future of our people rests on education and how to get it. We were delighted to work with the Deputy on that matter. School secretaries and caretakers are at the heart of the school and are the key interface between students, parents, school leaders and other members of teams within schools. They play a pivotal role and should be treated with the same respect as is afforded to all other members of a school's staff. Without them, our schools would be unsustainable. In supporting these vital school staff members, we also support the school community as a whole. The Department is committed to ensuring that school caretakers will be afforded the opportunity to avail of a similar package which was offered to school secretaries on foot of an agreement reached in the Workplace Relations Commission, WRC, in 2022. My Department has been engaging with Fórsa over the past number of weeks under the auspices of the WRC and with the Department of Public Expenditure, Infrastructure, Public Service Reform and Digitalisation in relation to a number of claims, including a claim for a comparable pension entitlement. The matter has now been referred to the Labour Court and a hearing will take place on 12 January 2026. The parties remain in process and my Department remains committed and ready to engage with Fórsa to reach a resolution on this important matter. The Deputy will understand that as with any industrial relations process where engagement is sensitive and complex, the matters under discussion are confidential until this process concludes.

The Minister of State said that the same package that was agreed with secretaries will be offered to caretakers. That package is a load of rubbish. I would not even offer it to the caretakers. It is a matter of disrespect. I would not offer it to them. I know, and the Minister of State knows that I know, about this issue first hand. I live at home with my grandmother, who has been a secretary for nearly 30 years. She is the longest serving staff member at St. Patrick's Boys' National School in Mallow. She will not be entitled to a pension. That is the difficulty. She is 70 years old and does not feel like she can retire because of that income. It is the same for a lot of secretaries and caretakers across the country. The matter has been to the Labour Court and the WRC. What engagement is the Department having with the secretaries and caretakers, and with Fórsa? The Minister of State referred to a possible resolution that the Department will come up with. What is the resolution that the Department is putting forward?

To be absolutely fair, a Labour Court hearing will take place on 12 January 2026 and it would be against all procedures for me to come in here and undermine negotiations that are ongoing and the detailed work that is going on. As I said at the outset, I understand the position of the caretakers and secretaries, and I understand the Deputy's person involvement in the issue. I compliment his grandmother and others who have kept education running in many communities. When you walk into a school, the school secretary is the person who knows the heartbeat of the school. There is engagement between the Department, Fórsa and the Department of public expenditure, as would be the case for any such issue. The matter is before the Labour Court on 12 January, and it is important that we allow the process to continue. The Department very much values caretakers and secretaries across the school system.

I appreciate the Minister of State's response and I am sure that my grandmother would appreciate the kind comments. What we do not want is what happened at the beginning of this academic year, when secretaries and caretakers were outside schools and the Dáil Chamber, protesting for fairness, dignity and respect. That is what this is about. Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael backbenchers were standing outside schools, getting into pictures and showing off that they were in support of secretaries and caretakers. I do not doubt their individual bona fides on the issue but I doubt the commitment of the Government, the Department of Education and Youth and the Department of public expenditure to providing that respect, dignity and equality to those secretaries and caretakers across the country. It is predominantly women who are affected. Those of an older generation are affected. I ask the Minister of State not to let down these secretaries and caretakers. I plead with him. Let this be his involvement in this Department. Let securing respect, dignity and entitlements for all secretaries and caretakers across the country be his legacy in the Department.

We in the Department, across the Government and across the House support secretaries and caretakers. Earlier this year when they went as far as industrial action, many people stood with them because they understood and accepted the importance of caretakers and secretaries to school communities. It is important that we give that voice across the House, whether those speaking are in government or in opposition. We must give a voice to the issue because it gives a clear indication to us and the Department of the strength of support that secretaries and caretakers have across the House. As I said, there is ongoing engagement with the Labour Court at the moment and there will be a hearing on 12 January. I assure the Deputy that we are committed to finding a meaningful resolution and ensuring that the roles of caretakers and secretaries within school communities are appreciated. We understand the importance of them.