2026-01-22

11. Deputy Paul Murphy asked the Minister for Health if she will legislate to end the three-day wait for abortion services; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [4679/26]

I do not know whether there is any other law that imposes a three-day wait on any medical treatment. I do not know whether it applies when getting Viagra or rhinoplasty surgery. Forcing women to wait for a health treatment that is extremely time sensitive and very geographically difficult to access, where that wait is medically unnecessary, damaging and patronising and puts extra pressure on our health services, has to stop. Does the Minister agree with that?

I appreciate the Deputy's question. My Department is committed to ensuring there is safe and equitable access to termination of pregnancy services. We have taken a number of important actions to give effect to that, on which I will update the House. In line with the programme for Government, all 19 maternity hospitals are now providing termination of pregnancy services. There has also been a continuous increase in the number of community providers, which currently stands at 487. That is hugely significant in the context of respecting women's rights and choices. My Department also approved the revised model of care, introduced during the Covid period, as the enduring model of care. Under its blended approach, it is possible for one of the two consultations currently prescribed by legislation for termination in early pregnancy to take place remotely. Safe access zones were introduced to protect the right to lawful access to healthcare services with dignity and privacy. The cumulative aim and effect of these measures is to substantially reduce barriers and increase the availability of services for those who need them. The legislation in place is consistent with commitments given to the Irish people prior to the repeal of the eighth amendment. The issue of legislative change, including changes to the three-day wait, requires very careful consideration. I respect the different views on these benches and on the benches opposite regarding the next steps to be taken. That is the reason I voted last week to enable Deputy Paul Murphy's Bill to come back on the floor of the House. It is important to have a Chamber that enables freedom of speech and debate and that we have dialogue on this issue. Deputy Murphy's legislation deals with a number of specific issues, some of which I might agree with and some with which I definitely would not agree. It is important to have a very broad debate. I respect the work done in the review. There is no consensus at the moment in relation to the next steps. The Deputy, in putting forward this question today, is continuing the debate, which is so important.

To be frank, we should not really need consensus for an individual to get healthcare. It should not be up to men, predominantly, in the Dáil, or the State in general, to prevent women or pregnant people from accessing something for which the whole country voted. The Minister is right that we had telemedicine during the pandemic, and the sky did not fall in. In fact, telemedicine for abortion care has been shown to be exactly the same as visiting a doctor, and that was shown before the referendum as well. The Irish Family Planning Association, WHO, the independent O'Shea report in 2023 and the UN are among the endless list of bodies that have said this wait is not necessary. It is also very unfair. Rural Deputies and others who think it must be kept are actually just penalising women and pregnant people in their areas. It is more difficult to find a doctor providing this service in rural areas, with some counties having one and others none. This is forcing women abroad again. It is taking them past the 12-week limit, with many ending up having to travel abroad.

I really do hear the Deputy. I respect that there are so many different views on this issue. I am broadly pro-choice and voted that way but I am not unreservedly pro-choice. Certainly, there are many elements of Deputy Murphy's Bill I simply do not agree with and cannot find a way to agree with. As Minister, I have tried to facilitate the broadest debate. I really do respect the very different opinions and the very different articulations of those opinions on all sides of the House. Prior to becoming Minister, I was involved with the family planning group. I think I am the first Minister to invite the pro-life groups into the Department of Health to hear their perspectives. I want to ensure all voices and perspectives on this issues are heard. I would like to see the greatest of respect for individual personal choice. I respect that the Deputy says consensus is not necessary. In fact, in a legislative Chamber, consensus is very necessary. That is why I am somebody who tries to take every step to listen to everybody and reach a consensus, which is what is necessary in a legislative Chamber.

Consensus seems only to be necessary when it comes to the health, lives and choices of women. The Bill the Minister referenced was actually put forward in the previous Dáil by former Deputy, Bríd Smith.

I apologise.

That is no problem; I am just clarifying it. It was very undemocratic of TDs who had not debated that Bill - I had not debated it because I was not in the previous Dáil - just to block it. It should have been allowed to go forward for debate. My understanding is that all the provisions in the Bill were measures the citizens' assembly had proposed but that the politicians on the relevant committee, of which I was a member, were not willing to put forward. They were perfectly normal measures that the broad population agreed with but politicians were not willing to implement. The three-day wait requirement was put in the legislation to appease Simon Coveney and people like him. That is the reality. I was here and I remember it. It was not indicated at the committee or anywhere else. The key point is that we now have very right-wing TDs in the Government who are anti-choice. The Minister should not be appeasing that bloc. The priority should be the health needs of women and pregnant people in this country.

The very essence of democratic choice is that those who are elected by the people may come into this House and freely choose how they wish to vote. I have every respect for Deputy Coppinger's vote, just as I have every respect for the votes of the Minister of State, Deputy Butler, and of Deputies O'Shea, Ó Muirí, Kerrane and every single person in this House. I respect their vote, their perspective, how they represent their constituents and what they are doing here. That is the democratic process. Citizens' assemblies provide an important informative process but it is not a democratic process. We are entitled to make choices about what we debate. Despite not agreeing with many parts of that Bill - though I agree with some of it - I would always choose to have that debate, but my choice is my choice as the Deputy's choice is hers. That is the essence of what she and I are saying to each other. I have such regard for listening to and respecting other voices. We reached the opportunity of the 2018 referendum precisely because of that approach and precisely because of an attempt to build consensus and to enable and facilitate that listening and respect. As Minister for Health, that is the approach I would like to continue to take.

It was a movement that achieved that, not this Dáil.