2026-06-18

I move: That Dáil Éireann shall take note of the Report of the Joint Committee on Disability Matters entitled "Report on Inclusive Education for Persons with Disabilities", copies of which were laid before Dáil Éireann on 25th March, 2026. I welcome the opportunity to move this motion and to present the committee's report on inclusive education for persons with disabilities. I acknowledge the disabled learners, families, educators, representative organisations, service providers and other experts, especially Corpus Christi Primary School in my own constituency of Limerick city and St. James's Primary School in Dublin, who contributed to the committee's work. Their input was invaluable. Their lived experience, expertise and insights were central to the development of the report and its recommendations. While reading the report, I encourage the Minister of State and his officials to look especially at the Sky is the Limit programme operating in Corpus Christi Primary School in Moyross in my constituency of Limerick city. The school both presented before the committee and hosted members of the committee at the school on the importance of this inclusive education project. The project aims to provide psychological support to members of the school community and the surrounding community, recognising that education does not end at the school gate. The programme embeds counselling, therapy and family support services within the school environment, thus allowing pupils and parents to access help that would otherwise be difficult for them to navigate. It is a model that could be looked at as part of needed changes to how we deal with the issue of special education. We cannot rinse and repeat the same tired and outdated approach to special educational needs. We need to do much better. The community of Moyross has faced many challenges over the years, from organised crime and drug dealing to violent feuds and deprivation. The work community members have done, particularly in partnership with the local school, has turned the area into a thriving community with one of the best primary schools in Limerick, if not the best. I mention this just to highlight how important inclusive education is not just for children but for their teachers, their family members and the wider community. On the report itself, the Joint Committee on Disability Matters undertook a comprehensive examination of inclusive education for persons with disabilities through a programme of public meetings, engagements with stakeholders and consideration of written submissions. The committee's work was guided by Article 24 of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities, which recognises the right of persons with disabilities to education without discrimination on the basis of equal opportunity. The committee considers inclusive education to be a fundamental rights issue. Inclusive education is not solely about where a child is educated. It is about ensuring that all learners can participate, communicate, belong and achieve their full potential within the education system. The committee's 33 recommendations provide a practical roadmap towards a more inclusive education system. The committee heard that significant progress has been made in recent years through investment in special educational supports, special classes and additional teaching resources. However, witnesses also identified significant barriers that continue to impede the full realisation of inclusive education. A recurring theme throughout the committee's engagement was the need to strengthen Ireland's legislative and policy framework so that it more fully reflects the principles and requirements of Article 24 of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities. The committee therefore recommends that legislation, policy and practice be reviewed and strengthened to support a rights-based approach to inclusive education to advance Ireland's obligations under the convention. Witnesses emphasised that inclusive education is not solely about access to supports and services. It is also about ensuring that learners experience belonging, participation, dignity and respect within their schools and education communities. The committee heard that many families continue to experience difficulties accessing educational supports and services. Witnesses highlighted the importance of ensuring that supports are responsive to the needs of learners and are available in a timely and equitable manner. The committee recommends that access to supports become increasingly responsive to the needs of learners and less dependent on diagnostic labels alone. The committee also heard significant evidence regarding workforce shortages across educational psychology, speech and language therapy, occupational therapy and other specialist services. Witnesses highlighted the impact these shortages can have on participation, communication, educational attainment and well-being. The committee, therefore, recommends the development of a national workforce plan to address staffing shortages and improve access to specialist supports. The committee heard strong evidence regarding the importance of communication rights and access to appropriate communication supports. Particular attention was drawn to the experience of deaf learners, the implementation of the Irish Sign Language Act 2017 and the importance of ensuring access to Irish Sign Language and other communication supports, including augmentative and alternative communications. The committee recommends strengthening the implementation of communication rights and improved access to the supports necessary to enable learners to participate fully in education. The committee also heard evidence regarding the importance of learner voice and participation in decision making. The committee emphasised that disabled learners should be supported to participate in decisions affecting their education and that their views should be taken into account in education planning and policy development. Witnesses highlighted the benefit of inclusive education practices and school environments that are designed to accommodate diverse learners from the outset. The committee, therefore, recommended the further embedding of universal design for learning principles across teacher education, continued professional development and classroom practice. The committee heard evidence regarding the value of multidisciplinary working and the importance of closer collaboration between education, health and disability services. The committee recommended the expansion of initiatives, such as the in-school therapy support demonstration project and strengthened inter-agency co-ordination to support learners and families. The committee also examined transitions between early years settings, primary education, post-primary education and further and higher education which were identified as particular points of vulnerability for learners with disabilities. The committee recommended improving planning, co-ordination and continuity of support during these transitions. The committee considered barriers experienced by disabled learners in further and higher education and recommended continued action to improve accessibility, participation and support across all stages of the education system. Evidence received by the committee highlighted concerns regarding the use of reduced timetables and the impact that such arrangements can have on educational participation. The committee recommended that reduced timetables should be used only in exceptional circumstances for the shortest possible period and subject to appropriate safeguards and oversight. The committee also heard evidence regarding the need for stronger data collection and monitoring and accountability mechanisms to support evidence-based policymaking and measures progressing towards inclusion. The committee recommended improved collection and publication of data to support planning, transparency and accountability across the education system. A consistent message throughout the committee's work was that disabled people and their representative organisations must be involved in the development of policies that affect their lives. The committee, therefore, emphasised the importance of consultation and coproduction with disabled learners, families and disabled organisations in accordance with the principles of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities and the principle of "nothing about us, without us". The committee recognises that achieving inclusive education will require sustained implementation, co-ordination and accountability across government. The report, therefore, recommends a co-ordinated approach to implementation and involving the education, health and disability sectors. Progress will depend, not only education policy, but also on disability services, health support, transport, workforce planning and broader societal inclusion. The committee believes that the implementation of these recommendations will support the development of an education system in which all learners, regardless of their disability, are able to participate fully, achieve their potential and enjoy equal opportunities throughout their educational journey. I look forward to other Members' contributions. I will come back in at the end of the debate.

I express my gratitude to everyone and thank all the members of the joint committee for their work in preparing this report. I know full well the work that they are engaging with. As I was the chair of the committee in the previous Dáil term, I am aware of the work, effort and preparation involved. I have watched a number of the committee's meetings over the past year or so. The dedication, commitment and the depth of knowledge within the committee is a joy to behold. The seriousness that members take their role as advocates in the committee for disability matters is hugely important. I congratulate each and every one of them for their input into it. It is one of the most important committees in the Houses of Oireachtas because one fifth of us now according to the various censuses have a disability of one type or another. The committee is led by Mairead who had a huge influence. There is a great team on the disability committee. I thank them all for that. There are a number of issues that were raised in the report on inclusive education. In his opening remarks, the Chairman mentioned a school in his constituency in Limerick. If there is proper investment in education for people with additional needs or disabilities, they can flourish in all those settings. It is about how we pathway that to grow. Since my appointment to this role, I have taken on this role extremely seriously and I have worked with all stakeholders to ensure that we have the best possible education system. A number of the points were made in the report regarding the transitions in education. In any child's life who has a disability when they enter preschool, go from preschool to primary school, then go to primary to post-primary and then onto adulthood, those key points are hugely important. In my engagement, not just as chair of the committee, but as a public representative for a number of years, families have been in contact with me. They are the key points or the key difficult moments in family's lives. It is important that we have the right resources in place there. Over the past week or so, I am pleased that we have secured additional funding, particularly on special schools, and there will be extra resources given to special schools to guide the students and their families as to what the future looks like when they leave the special school, whether it is into supported employment, day services or beyond. They are a hugely important piece in it. If we compare September 2025 and September 2026, we will have close to 1,000 extra special classes opened across the country at primary and post-primary level. These classes did not just come about. A lot of work done by the Department, Deputy McEntee in her time in the Department, the Minister, Deputy Naughton, myself and the school communities over the past 12 months to bring this to fruition. With the engagement that the committee has had with school authorities and school communities, it is important to note that there is a huge openness across primary and post-primary schools to engage with specialised education and to improve and make sure that we have more inclusivity and classes within that. That is a work that is being done. We have also introduced the new inclusive special classes at post-primary and primary, which have been welcomed by the school communities. We have to embed them and ensure that we are doing the right thing. The one thing that I constantly I push is that the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities is an overarching document with overarching reach. The optional protocol was one the issues that we addressed in our committee and to ensure it was signed during the term of the previous Government, which it was finally. It is only as good as how the Republic of Ireland will interpret that and ensure that we have the supports in place to ensure that every child matters and that every child that goes through education who has special educational needs has the best possible outcomes within the education system. I passionately believe that if we invest properly in special education, we will improve the life cycle of the individuals who has special educational needs and their families. We will also improve a variety of issues societally.. That is fundamental. As a country, we have invested hugely in education over the past 100 or so years, which has served us well. We have to ensure that we continue the level of engagement and support across the special education system to ensure that the best possible outcomes for children with disabilities. Over the past five or six weeks, in five locations across the country, we met the principals of the special schools. We sat down with them for four or five hours on a Friday to see what the challenges are for them in their school communities, including what they, their teams, their leadership, teachers and SNAs face on a daily basis and to feed that back to ensure that we are doing the right thing. One of the big issues they were looking at was career guidance. What we have done is ensure that hours are provided across the special schools to support students and their families into the future. We also worked extremely hard in relation the SNA workforce development plan, the workforce redeployment plan and the circular which will replace the 2014 circular. The 2026 circular has been brought out. It gives certainty to many thousands. This year alone, over 26,000 SNAs will be employed in the education system. That number will increase over the coming years. We are listening carefully to what is being said. I was delighted to meet members of the committee in Liskennett recently. Everybody who was at the centre in Liskennett was really impressed with the service provided there and the ongoing work being done by St. Joseph's Foundation in Charleville. I congratulate the Joint Committee on Disability Matters on visiting the site to see the work being done at first hand. The service in question works with 80 schools across the region. It provides therapy sessions to special classes and special schools. It is an integral part of those classes and schools in the context of the wider community. On one of the days I was there, people had travelled from as far north as Ennistymon in County Clare, Limerick, Tipperary and beyond to get an hour or less of equine therapy. Such therapy is of huge benefit to the children. You could not but be impressed by the work ethic of the teams at Liskennett and by the services they provide for the children involved. It supplements and supports special classes and inclusive education. We are starting inclusive special classes this year. Other countries tell us that they do not have special schools but that they have very inclusive models. Not every child, because of their needs, can meet the strict criteria. We have to have special schools, special classes and integrated classes across the system. Some practitioners in education have been extremely capable in pushing the boat out and challenging me and other policymakers as to the best next steps for education and how we can be more inclusive. We have been engaging thoroughly since I took up this role, for example, with the National Council for Special Education, and the work it does. Over the past number of years we have increased the number of special educational needs organisers, SENOs, from 60 to 120. There are now more SENOs who liaise with families to ensure that they make the best possible informed decisions for their children. Last year, we had the 51 recommendations regarding the Education for Persons with Special Educational Needs, EPSEN, Act. The latter was developed over 20 years ago and was reviewed in the context of how we make sure that we have the best possible education system and the next steps. I was Chair of the education committee 20 years ago when people were talking about mainstreaming and the challenges involved Education has evolved enormously in those 20 years for the better. We must now look at the next 20 years in the context of what is the right thing to do with the review of the EPSEN Act. The Government is holding a forum on special education and ensuring that the various stakeholders are talking about the next steps. We all have to understand that our schools are our future. It is important to ensure that we are engaging. In every role across the education system, we see great practice. I could not but have been impressed by what has been done at Maynooth Community College. It reached out and set up a sports day for every special class in Leinster. Students in special classes in post-primary schools across Leinster were all invited to take part. I was there on the morning of the launch. No matter the challenges, you would have to be extremely impressed by the co-ordination involved, by the people in Maynooth Community College who were driving it in the first instance, by their understanding of the concept in having the special classes involved in their own day - all other students have their sports days - and by their energy, commitment and dedication. Those are some of the great practices. When I was first appointed, people said we should look at best practice across different countries. We have a lot of very good practice in our education system, however. The challenge is to ensure that we replicate that best practice across the country. The committee's report speaks to the many challenges and issues we have to face up to across education, including teacher training, reduced timetables and exclusion, which is important at school level. I spoke about transition and inclusion. The Chair raised the issue of sign languages and co-ordination. We are best able to implement policy by collecting data and ensuring that we have the relevant data across the education system. Governance is also important. I cannot but congratulate the committee unreservedly on its work. I appeal to all the members of the committee to continue with that work. If we continue to invest in specialised education as we are - one third of the budget is being spent on specialised education - in the years head we will see great benefits for the children, their families and wider society. I am delighted to accept this report. I encourage the committee to continue its work. It is hugely important.

I also add my congratulations and thanks to the committee. It is a great committee and does fantastic work. I call Deputy Toole.

I thank Deputy Quinlivan for chairing our committee so ably and for tolerating a lot of toing and froing and time overruns, but the purpose and spirit committee members brought to the task at hand is manifest in the report. I urge all Members of both Houses and officials in all Departments to pay special attention to it. The report runs to 42 pages. Pages 9 to 11 are the key pages because they contain the 33 recommendations. None of our work would have been possible without the submissions, in-person attendance and work of the secretariat in the background, keeping us on the straight and narrow and providing research and guidance. We had contributions from special needs assistants, personal assistants, teachers, allied healthcare professionals, service providers at the coalface and the National Council of Special Education. I appreciate that whole school communities have had quite a lot of turmoil and policy change to grapple with in recent years. They have risen to the challenge wholeheartedly and are producing fantastic results for our children and for our future, while trying to manage change in policy with finite resource and oft times very scarce resources. That places immense stress on the system. They are then trying to co-ordinate communication with parents, linking in with the health sector, and linking in with all the different service providers that may be appropriate along the way. What has become evident, and it is manifest in Article 24 of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities, UNCRPD, is that the focus now has to be needs based and on the needs of the child, and not necessarily set in concrete in a diagnostic process. We are moving towards a change in that area. I am quite an impatient person so I suppose I am always thinking of what actions can we actually implement. We are part of a five-year cycle and I hope the recommendations in the report do not take the full term to achieve implementation. I will give an example of where action has come about quite quickly, and the Minister of State, Deputy Moynihan, referred to it. I visited St. Bernadette's in Letterkenny on Monday. My niece is on the staff there. Mr. Haran, the principal there, welcomed the recent funding for that transition piece from primary to secondary, and secondary to tertiary or to service provision. That is most welcome. The Minister of State is hitting the ground running so more would be most welcome. The objective of Article 24 and the right that underpins all this is that all learners with disabilities can access an inclusive, high-quality education system with the appropriate supports, with reasonable accommodation, and without discrimination. The results in the report will address all that in succession. It is fair to say at this stage that national policy has evolved considerably. I cast my mind back to the time when I was a child and my mother was a primary school teacher in County Meath. When the bell rang, as kids all we wanted to do was get out, get into the car and go home. We did not quite understand why mam might have been the extra hour or even the extra hour and a half or two hours after school. What she was actually doing at that time was ad hoc support and assistance to children in her care who needed it. Cross check that with the current situation with the EPSEN Act, the review thereof and the recommendations, and things are moving in the right direction. Again I refer to my impatience. What I would like to see, and I think the signs are good, is that the education, health and disability supports that are currently fragmented across regions and perhaps across schools and between individual children, will all move to a point where we have inter-agency co-ordination and we have joined-up working. That is essential. There is a task force within the Department of the Taoiseach. There is the Minister of State's Department of Education and Youth. We have the Department of Children, Equality and Disability. It is about more of those links. I am being cheeky now but the Cathaoirleach of the Joint Committee on Disability Matters is here. I am jumping ahead but I would like to see more attendances at our committee meetings, either in public or in private session, so we are very much aware of what the different groups are doing and that we are all on the same page, so we can deliver outcomes for children as quickly as possible. I will refer to some of the points that witnesses have emphasised. The key starting point is that children's ability to learn and engage meaningfully in school is linked to emotional regulation, psychological safety, and access to timely therapeutic supports. The Minister of State referred to the Liskennett centre and the fantastic work being done there through the medium of equine assisted therapy. This is the type of approach that helps with regulation and helps with the release of oxytocin, which biochemically helps bring about calmness. When we have calmness and regulation, the channels open up for learning. The good work at Liskennett is being replicated at Clonalvy in County Meath with Joy Murray and at Stewarts Care in Kilcloon through Terri Brosnan and her team there. We wish to see more of that. I appreciate that officials are looking for an evidence base but I would like to flag something with the Minister of State that I noticed on social media, which is the Department of agriculture funded equine therapy and programmes that are available around the country for the children of farming communities who have additional needs. If the Department of agriculture can do it, perhaps we could see more of that provided through the Minister of State's Department. I am very happy to work with him on that. Well-being supports are well proven to help sustain inclusion for students with complex needs. As referred to on page 25 of the report, there is a requirement for holistic, multidisciplinary, social and emotional supports. We had a fantastic visit to the Corpus Christi school in Limerick where we met with the team there. We had the team from St. James's primary school in to visit us. I have been to St. Bernadette's. We also have St. Mary's in County Meath. This is not to take away for one minute from the work that is being done in special classes. I would also like to commend the library services through the local authorities, in particular Meath County Council. Through the healthy Meath programme, it has have embraced well-being classes and story massage through Una Curran, who has also done this online with other local authorities. If colleagues would like information to that effect, I can pass on her details. There is a whole area referenced in the report on art and music therapy. I will bring one book to the attention of Members. The question arises of the evidence base and whether there is there an evidence base for all these integrated therapies. There is indeed and there is an excellent book called Art Cure: the Science of How the Arts Transform our Health. It is also very beneficial to elder care. I just wanted to flag that. In the area of recruitment, I commend the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science, Deputy Lawless, and the Minister of State, Deputy Harkin, on the move towards the increased college places for occupational therapists, speech and language therapists and students of psychology, and for the reforms that are coming in the area of education. These are most welcome. I will give a particular mention to Dunboyne College of Further Education, which is now linking in with Enable Ireland and with the HSE primary care teams. To conclude, I would highly recommend all Members to please read the report. We refer to the area of personalised budgets and personal assistants minimally in the report but that is an area for future development. It underlies all our work on the committee. I will finish with a quotation from Dr. Margaret Mead, the famous American anthropologist. She had fantastic observations of the social norms of her day but they are very relevant at this point in time. The Minister of State made a similar comment this afternoon. Dr. Mead said, "The solution to adult problems tomorrow depends in large measure upon the way our children grow up today."

I also commend Deputy Quinlivan, as committee Chair, the clerk to the committee and the committee secretariat who have done a huge amount of work. I would like to tackle one of the issues Deputy Toole brought up. It is absolutely spurious to believe that anyone would have gone over time at the Joint Committee on Disability Matters and I would just like that recorded. I cannot imagine who she meant-----

I am looking at you.

-----and neither can the Minister of State.

No. Certainly not.

When we are talking about inclusive education we need to make sure that this is part of wider inclusivity. Deputy Quinlivan, two other members of the committee and I were lucky enough to be at the 19th Conference of States Parties to the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities on the 20th year of the UNCRPD. We dealt with a huge range of issues. It was everything from autism services for adults, to participation in sport right through to the role and impact of conflict on those with disabilities. I commend ambassador and permanent representative, Mr. Fergal Mythen, and the mission to the UN, whose guests we were, on what was a very worthwhile enterprise. We were doing this in the United Nations in New York when the regime in America is obviously putting extreme pressure on the United Nations and the whole idea of multilateralism and international law. On some level it nearly makes it more important at this point in time. The ethos across the board was about inclusivity and ensuring that those with disabilities could participate fully in every aspect of society. It was about mainstreaming, which is about supports and ensuring, as much possible when talking about education, that people with disabilities can play a full part in mainstream education if that suits. I understand that will be different for every person. On universal design, whether we are talking about course content, capital projects and settings like this, it is about ensuring as much as possible that we facilitate as many as possible. We are talking about those with mobility issues, those who Deputy Quinlivan spoke about who have issues with hearing, those who have vision-related issues and those who are neurodivergent. We already know that this particular Chamber would suit almost none of them but that is what we need to be about. It is about universal design, mainstreaming and reasonable accommodation. In fairness, that means it has to be reasonable. While we will not always be able to facilitate everyone, the plan should be to facilitate as many as possible and then, if we need bespoke solutions for those with more challenging needs, we should be able to provide them. I do not think I could continue on mentioning the NOW Group, that the Cathaoirleach Gníomhach, Deputy O'Reilly, a number of others and I were lucky enough to meet earlier. It is a social enterprise group that is based in Dublin, Belfast and throughout. I think it has a place in the Cathaoirleach Gníomhach's constituency. It was really worthwhile. No more than a lot of the interactions that the disability matters committee has had, we listened to people talking about their lived experience. We also dealt with the cost-of-living issue at the disability matters committee this week. I do not think I need to go into the absolute need for a cost-of-living payment and ensuring that it is for everybody, and not just those who are getting social protection payments based on their disability at present. We met representatives from the Irish Wheelchair Association, Rehab and AsIAm. Conor Lynott and Áine Dunne, in particular, spoke about their cases in relation to housing but no more than the young people from the NOW Group, they spoke about getting jobs, and how we do not allow for all those transitions, be they the transitions from early childcare through to primary, post-primary and tertiary education, as well as the transition into work. There are those who are worried about losing their payments and those who are worried about losing a medical card, even if it is a number of years later. We could be talking about people who have significant health needs. We also spoke about the issues that this State has to get better at in respect of facilitating the connection between industry, enterprise and these young people, who will be able to provide a real benefit to the economy and to these companies. In fairness, there was talk about how many companies are worried, have an element of trepidation and are unaware of the schemes that exist such as the wage subsidy scheme or the work and access programme. What also was pointed out to us is that those schemes are not fit for purpose. We must have a more comprehensive and holistic look at how we deal with disability. When we talk about inclusive education, we all know the issues that exist. We could literally spend our entire time here talking about the issues facing those who are waiting for an assessment of need. We could talk about those who, even if they have an assessment, cannot get the necessary therapies. For all of the improvements there have been with regard to workforce planning, we know that we need the back-up of assistive technology. When I am in these circumstances, I find it hard not to use the example that I know the best, which is our Turlough. I am sure that all the Members have heard me speak about him before. He is 17 and is autistic. He attends Ó Fiaich Institute of Further Education. He attended St. Joseph's National School before that and as I have said previously, he has been facilitated no end. I often talk about speech and language therapy, SLT, and what I will say is that he, his family and the school all would have been better off had those therapies happened within a school setting and had we been involved. It would have been even better if we had assistive technology rather than photocopies - and I am not taking away from the quality of the SLT that was provided - but from the State's point of view, it is about getting the best bang for buck. It is also about getting the best bang for buck from Turlough's point of view - who is the person who definitely needs it - as well as ensuring that I and my wife, who does all the heavy lifting in relation to most of this, would also get the best benefit out of it. Children of his age have no issue or rather probably too many issues in relation to using screens but we can all see how it would work if we were talking about assistive technology and apps that back up best practice and which would also benefit teaching staff and SNAs. Being from Limerick, Deputy Quinlivan could not but speak about the Corpus Christi Primary School. I also have to mention it. I was really taken with the principal, Tiernan O'Neill, and his staff. In fairness, I see it as nothing but an outlier school in relation to being at the absolute centre of the Moyross community but even beyond that, through fundraising it ensured that it had the supports that were required within that school setting. These are for all children and that is the idea of mainstreaming because we are talking about counselling and psychological services, along with SLT, OT and all those requirements that are needed. We often speak about early intervention without actually delivering it. In a lot of cases, if we could give most children that early intervention, it would probably reduce those situations and circumstances that arise. From the State's point of view, that would be easier, quicker, faster and cheaper. From a budgetary point of view, it is an absolute win-win. It is about ensuring that we can deliver this. The report also deals with the reality of the fact that we do not have enough OTs, SLTs, or psychologists and while we need to do those pieces of work, there is far more that we need to do. Deputy Toole spoke about how a lot of parents come to us and their issues are generally related to school, including reduced timetables. Some schools can be better than others depending on a number of factors. If there are staff changes and a particular SNA, teacher or SET leaves, it can change the dynamic within a school. Meltdowns can be very difficult to deal with but if strategies are employed, they can be reduced and are generally avoidable. I can speak from my own experience in this regard. Along with Liskennett and equine therapy, I could not but mention Louth Disability Cycling Club. I also have to mention that Louth County Council and the HSE are coming on board to make it into something that is sustainable because that is beneficial to those people with disabilities who engage with it and their families.

The Deputy's time is up.

It is well up.

I commend Deputy Quinlivan and the committee on producing a very good report. I have not read it all yet, but I have read a fair bit of it and it seems like an important piece of work. Well done to them all. I am not a member of the committee but it is an important issue. I have a particular reason I want to raise a specific issue with the Minister of State in relation to people's access to education and special needs assistance and I will get to it in a minute. The starting point of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities and the fact that equal access to education is a right for children regardless of disability or additional needs was brought into very sharp focus recently with the Government's move to reduce the number of special needs assistants in many schools and the explosion of anger from school communities that caused. The Government has responded to that explosion, but it highlights something that is terribly important, which is the need to listen to those who are impacted by our decisions and by whether the systems we have and the resources we allocate are adequate to actually ensure the quality we profess to try to achieve in terms of delivering equal access to education. What we learnt from school communities, parents, teachers and SNAs during the recent events is that the role of the SNA had massively evolved from when the 2014 circular, for example, was originally done up; that a sort of minimalist approach to the special needs resources that were needed for children was not adequate; that there had to be recognition of that evolution of the role of the SNA in providing social support, communication support and emotional support to children; and that a minimalist approach which led people to think they could reduce SNA support on spurious grounds failed to take on board the actual needs of children and the views and opinions of the SNAs, the parents and the school communities. It was a matter of listening to those directly affected. A "nothing about us without us" approach is terribly important in this regard. It is in that context that I want to highlight to the Minister of State - I do not know whether he got an email about this - the situation, which may be impacting more broadly than the particular example I have come across, of the allocation of SNAs to children under IPAS, which is a different system. The Government, in the context of the recent protests and so on, promised that there would be no reductions in SNA supports for schools in September, but that has not come to pass in the case of the provision of SNAs for children from IPAS accommodation. They are in the same schools as other children, but it is a different system for allocating special needs supports. I was not aware of that, but this is where you learn from people on the front line, in this case from Holy Family National School, in Monkstown Farm, in my area. The way SNAs are allocated is that for every 15 IPAS students the school has you get a half-time SNA, half a post, for 16 hours. If, however, the number of IPAS students drops below that number, you lose that. That is what has happened to Holy Family National School. This happens even if the number drops only temporarily. In the case of the Holy Family, the school informs me and has informed the Department that the number has briefly dropped below the threshold of 15 but that it will go back up above the threshold in September. In the meantime, however, the school has had the half an SNA post withdrawn and it simply cannot cope with the impact of that. It does seem crazy to have a cliff edge of that sort. If you have 15 students, you get half an SNA post, but if you have 14, you get none, so you just go over a cliff. Then the school has to pick up the slack, and that will impact everything else in the school. An injury to one is literally an injury to all, and that is not fair. I ask, on behalf of Holy Family National School, all the children involved - the IPAS children and all the other children - and the teachers who will be impacted as a result of that, for that to be addressed and for the schools, please, to be heard. It does speak more generally to something I think Simon Lewis said to me about the approach we have to have in ensuring inclusivity and in giving the necessary supports and resources to avoid a penny-pinching or box-ticking model that can end up not really doing justice to the actual human lived reality of children with disabilities or special needs. The way he put it, in literally one sentence, was that we have to trust schools, that we should just trust schools. There are so many buzzwords in all these documents, but I think that is what is referred to when we talk about rights-based and needs-based provision - that it is the actual needs that have to determine things, rather than ticking boxes or rationing resources, which is so often the case. That, I think, was at the back of the recent debacle in terms of the withdrawal of special needs supports for so many schools, causing panic and alarm in school communities across the country. We must recognise those on the front line: the parents, the teachers, the SNAs, the children themselves, the school communities. They can tell us what the needs are. They are the experts. They should be believed; they should not be distrusted. It should not be thought that they are trying to rip the Department off of resources. Their words should be accepted. That is not to say that very occasionally people might not look for things they do not need. By and large, however, people do not look for things they do not need, and there should not be an attitude at Department level that people are looking for things they do not deserve. It is when that attitude of gatekeeping comes in that we get problems. In my last minute and a half I wish to mention a couple of things. When will the pilot project on providing therapies in schools be expanded to all schools? From what I hear, it is a storming success, and how could it not be? How could providing OTs, speech and language therapists and psychologists in schools not be a good thing? We do not really need to pilot any more. It is working. Let us just do it and roll it out and have a plan to get all these speech and language therapists, psychologists and-----

In the new school year.

Excellent. Can we also, then, have psychology departments in post-primary schools? That would be the next thing, something that has happened in many other schools. We know mental health issues are huge in terms of special needs, neurodivergence and so on but also just generally for young people. There should be, as there are in many other countries, psychology departments in every single school. That should be an aspiration for us in every school. I agree with Deputy Toole's point about arts. When we talk about expanding the basic income for the arts scheme, we should develop a scheme to offer jobs to artists in every single school, whereby you get a decent, liveable income and you have time to practise your own art but also help bring art to children with special needs, disabilities and so on, and indeed to children generally in schools. That would be well worth investing in in every single school and would be an imperative to reach across the education system.

Congratulations to Deputy Quinlivan and everybody on the disability matters committee for this great document. I have read it. There is so much in it. It must have been a huge amount of work. It is very thorough. My colleague Deputy Liam Quaide is not able to speak today but he would love to have been able to do so. One of the things that struck me with this report is that in schools, education and in this place, we often silo things. The disability matters committee has done a wonderful report. We in the education and youth committee are down in committee room 4 most weeks, and we are looking at inclusive education. It is imperative that these two pieces of work meet each other and that we do not stay siloed. This is not about maths, Irish or English in school. It is serious and is about people's lives. I would love to see what comes out of our report and how they speak to one another. They are independent pieces of work but I have no doubt there will be so many things that are similar between them. The only difference is that ours will be for primary and secondary school and will not examine third level. That is the missing conversation that never happens in here. What happens for young people who go on to third level, whether to an apprenticeship or college or to any institution or course? The Disability Federation of Ireland has said that 25% of adults with disabilities have now completed third level in comparison to 32% of the general population. We are still not on a par. We need to ensure that tertiary education is as available as primary and secondary. It is not so easy. That conversation definitely needs to happen. I would love to see the further and higher education committee, which I attend although I am not a member, looking at the situation as well. On education and children with disabilities, not a day goes by that somebody does not contact my office about the state of things. I just got off the phone with a mother where the school clearly does not want the child to be there. Deputy Boyd Barrett said to trust the schools but in this scenario I do not. This poor child has been ostracised. I am obviously not going to name them. There are examples of poor practice around the country because of lack of leadership and lack of challenges. We need to make sure that if this is the situation, it is called out. For the most part, schools are doing absolutely excellently. However, not every school is suitable for every single child. If that is the case, how do we make sure a child does not continue in an education setting that ruins them as an individual? Separate to this, when I was a school completion co-ordinator, we had the iScoil programme. It is not for children with disabilities but for children who left school and were not in school for six months at a time. They would come to us broken, thinking they were stupid and thinking they were not able to learn anything. The system broke them because it did not understand them as individuals and their needs and rights. When they would come to us, we would have to build their confidence so they would know they are not stupid, and there is a place for them in this world and for every single person. We need to challenge that in every aspect of our education system at primary, secondary and third level, so nobody feels they are not able to be valued and have a place in that. The systems in this world have to fit around people. People do not have to be jammed into a system that is wrong for them. That is so important, particularly for people with disabilities who already face so many challenges in other aspects of their lives. Over the course of being a TD, I have been struck by the different types of challenges that people have when they have a disability. For example, on reading, there are reading classes that are being closed, or are not open or are full, because they are not being invested in. The vision is to be inclusive so that the local school will be the inclusive school and children will just go to their local school. That is fantastic but in the meantime, until that is a reality, we need to be safeguarding those reading classes and making sure that children have access to that. There are children who are going on to second level who have not managed to access or get through the primary school curriculum. They are not able to read it because they have not been given the skills to do that. We are using programmes like Reading Recovery, which is being struck off in other countries, and we are investing a quarter of a million euro or more in it. We need to look at structured literacy and how that happens, and why it is effective in the long term for children. While I am talking about books, I cannot ever forget about the young person who came to the education committee and told us that he got his Braille books the week before he was doing the leaving certificate, even though they were ordered in fourth year. I just cannot get over that. There is a system that shows an absolute breakdown for a child, that they would not have their books for the two years of studying the leaving certificate. I have mentioned mild general learning disability schools so many times. I did not know they existed until I was a TD. Now I know. I have been at one and was at a beautiful graduation in Scoil Eoin in Crumlin last week. I was trying not to cry too much since it was not my children, but it was absolutely gorgeous. Those young people have left that school with their heads held so high, with absolute support, love and care. They are going to meet the world right where it is and will be able to do whatever they want in the future because of the care they got in that school. I know we want to have the local school being the inclusive school, but until that is an actual reality we cannot close those schools because those children will not get the same love and care in a school with 1,000 pupils. There is just no way they can. There is a balancing act. When we transition into the new system we would like to have, we need to make sure that until we are definitely able to deliver on that side, we do not put those children in jeopardy. Today in the education committee the teacher and SNA unions were in. One of the challenges they have is the lack of time for planning. They do not just rock up on a Monday morning at 9 o'clock and decide what they are doing today. They have to have plans. That needs to be built in, particularly if they are supporting children with additional needs. It is about what needs to be done, when, what is the routine and who is doing what - all those things. That needs to be built in to the planning week, as does the overall view of how inclusive education is done in a school. It is the culture of a school and who manages it. When the principal is running around doing all the other things, who is the person who instils that culture in a school? The principal is that person but she or he cannot do everything. We need a way of making sure that culture is there in schools. We also need to make sure for any school that is being opened, a special school or special class, that the training is there for those staff members. Teachers who are newly qualified or who are very long in the system are telling me time and again that they did learn anything about this in college, yet they are expected to go in and work with the child when they have no idea how to manage or do that. It is not good enough. We are failing the teacher or SNA and we are failing the child. We need to make sure that the training and CPD is there for the best chance for everybody in the situation. I agree that it has to be rights-based and needs-based. It needs to be about fairness and equality, but also equity. We cannot give everybody the same because some people need more than others. There is a fine balance as to how we make sure that everybody gets exactly what is appropriate to them to make sure they are on an equal footing with everybody else. When I was visiting a school a very long time ago, I saw a lovely picture of children looking over a wall. You just saw their faces across the wall, but on the other side you saw children of different heights. Some were standing on a higher or lower ladder or stool, but they all looked the same from the other side of the wall. It was showing what equity is. Equity is to give people what they need in order for them to be on an equal footing with everybody else. That is not only for primary and secondary school but also for third level. Early intervention classes set children up to succeed in primary school. We cannot see them closed until we have proper alternatives in our primary schools.

I thank the Members for their contributions. A number of issues were raised. It was remiss of me at the start not to talk about the education therapy services. We made a decision at Government back in March or April of 2025. Some people said we would not be able to do it. This involves the whole of Government. It was a decision made at the Cabinet disability committee. The housing committee is the committee that meets the most, and the disability subcommittee is second. A decision was taken to put therapies back into schools, starting with special schools and then rolling services out elsewhere. There are two elements to that. The first is recruitment. Thankfully we have had a successful recruitment process. Services will be clinically led by the NCSE and the structure is in place. Services are being rolled out in special schools. The Department of further and higher education has examined expanding the amount of training and college places available for occupational therapists, speech and language therapists, behavioural therapists and other therapists. We cannot manufacture therapists; we have to train them through the system. We are working extensively across Government. We have increased capacity in third level colleges to ensure that we have an adequate number of occupational and speech and language therapists. The other piece is that heretofore no block release was available for occupational therapy, in particular, for special schools in Ireland. A number of occupational therapists were being trained in college and were then going to block release in the UK or other jurisdictions. We know when people go on block release we lose a certain percentage of them. From this year, that is being addressed in special schools. Block release is available for education therapy services. This is a great enabler and will be significant for students who are going to special schools. We have to continue to monitor and work on that. I can report to the House that is being done. There was a pilot scheme in 2024. The new scheme includes 45 schools and is a permanent scheme to provide therapies. It will be rolled out to over 140 schools. Over the past five years we have added another 20 special schools across the system because we need to build capacity in terms of education therapy. It will be a great enabler for the system. The teams working in special schools are superhuman beings and are doing an amazing job. We have to encourage and understand them. That is why I reached out to all the principals over the past number of weeks and met them face-to-face. We will continue to examine schools that have embraced special classes, including inclusive special classes, with such great enthusiasm and excitement. Across the Chamber I heard about the commitment and dedication to special education. I reflected on some of the reports we launched when I was chair of the committee. The level of commitment to special education and disability on the floor of the Dáil is a joy to behold. People are well informed and see the challenges. We are dealing with a system that is evolving and we have to ensure that we are equipping the system not just for the short term but for the next decade and beyond. We spoke about the workforce development plan over the next decade or so. We have to ensure that we are equipping it for the next decade and beyond. The decisions that we make today are for the betterment of society. I thank Members for their contributions. I engaged with all of those who contributed as best I could individually and collectively. I thank the Committee on Disability Matters for the work it does. I ask that it continue the good work and I look forward to going before it again in the not too distant future. The committee visited Liskennett in Limerick. The committee is a powerful body and the more it is out in communities and groups the more informed the Oireachtas is, so keep up the good work.

I thank the Minister of State for his kind and supportive comments for the committee and its members. It is much appreciated. I thank all of the members of the committee who contributed to the report, turned up to meetings, read all of the submissions, made suggestions, changes and amendments and helped us to deliver what I believe is a good report. I hope it will be accepted. I want to I record my thanks to the committee secretariat, ably led by Mairead O'Donovan and supported by Ronan O'Connor and Tracey Driscoll, who did a fantastic job in delivering the report. Inclusive education, as I said, is not simply about access to school places but also participation, belonging, communications, achievement and equal opportunities. Last week, as Deputy Ó Murchú said, members of the Committee on Disability Matters visited New York city to attend events around the application of the United Nations CRPD on its twentieth anniversary. The committee's recommendation provides a practical roadmap to advance inclusive education in Ireland, in line with Article 24 of the UN CRPD. I take this opportunity to thank ambassador Fergal Mythen and the team at Ireland's permanent mission to the UN for the fantastic support they gave the committee in terms of organising meetings and events and hosting meetings at the permanent mission across the road from the UN. The meetings were very useful and there were learning experiences for all of us. I thank the members of the committee and committee secretariat for their work in developing the report and all of those who engaged with the committee throughout the process. The committee hopes that the recommendations contained in the report will assist in advancing an education system in which every learner is valued, supported and enabled to participate fully. I again thank everybody who contributed to the report.